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I am creating this journal as an explanation as to why I do not allow horses or wolves to be added to my premade backgrounds and do not allow my wings to be attatched to them without my prior permission.

Let me begin by saying that I have absolutely nothing against horses or wolves, both are beautiful, amazing animals, nor do I have anything against the amazing deviants that create horse and/or wolf art.

I really don't know exactly how to put this together...

To make my rules regarding this concern as simple as possible I have stated on each premade background and wing stock that I do not allow horse or wolf manipulations without prior permission, unfortunately, the statement is rarely read, if anyone has any suggestions as to how to make it more visable, please feel free to make them.

Why don't you allow your stock on horse and wolf sites?



:bulletblue: I don't want the stock use requests that will come with my stock being there.
:bulleblue: Why? For some reason, my rules are rarely followed by those making the requests.


Why do I require permission or disallow completely?



Because I want to make sure that you intend to create an actual photomanipulation and not a horse or wolf on a premade and because I have seen my stock many times go stolen: aka unnotified and uncredited.


with regard to...

Premade Backgrounds



:bulletblue: To begin: A horse dropped onto a premade background is not a photomanipulation; It is a cut/paste project.

:bulletblue: It makes me so very sad to see this happening.

:bulletblue: Please make an effort if you want to use premade backgrounds, use photo filters and refine your cuting skill and try new things.

:bulletblue: It makes me especially sad to see pre-cut horses dropped onto premade backgrounds, and even more so when the colors of the two images don't match at all.

:bulletblue: Also, particularly a horse on a beach has no originality; but at least think about putting a shadow on the image.

:bulletblue: If you truly want to use one of my premade backgrounds and I've declined permission, you're more than welcome to re-create the background using the same stocks that I used.

Wings



:bulletblue: The same applies for my wings, I very much dislike seeing them carelessly dropped on a horse or wolf without any apparent effort to make them appear that they belong there.

To aid in expressing the type of image that I don't want to see, I've created this one...

(The above image is created with one of my own premade backgrounds, my own horse image, and my own wings)
Edge of Desolation - Stock by Thy-Darkest-HourSpread White Wings PNG by Thy-Darkest-HourHorse Stock 06 by Thy-Darkest-Hour
Keep in mind, this is an example of what not to do.
I want to state that it took me approximately nine minutes to create this image in just a few steps, which included cutting out the horse.

Lets critique it!



1. The horse is well cut, not great, but okay, it took a whole 7 minutes.
2. The horse, though white, doesn't really match the same levels as the background.
3. The horse isn't casting a shadow.
4. There is sand over the hooves in an attempt to put the animal in the sand.
5. The wings look dropped on.
6. The horse looks dropped on.
7. He looks like he's eating sand.

How could I improve it?



1. I could photo filter the horse with a blue/gray filter.
2. I could adjust the levels for the horse.
3. I could blur out a small section of the bottom of the hooves to make it better fit on the sand.
4. I could add a shadow for the horse and wings in total.
5. I could apply an over-color layer for an overall color cohesiveness effect.
6. I could add a little grass to make it look like he's not eating sand.
7. I could draw some extra mane and tail hair.
8. I could adjust the size, size, color, and perspective of the wings and use the clone brush where they attatch.

My advice...



:bulletblue: Try new things, go out of your way to try things like color photo filters, the different types of eraser tools, different brushes, add additional elements if using premade backgrounds, and practice, practice, practice.

:bulletblue: And if you have any questions or want any personal advice concerning photoshop techniques, please feel free to ask me, but I don't know a darn thing about gimp.

Why don't you allow your stock on horse and wolf sites?



:bulletblue: Because once it shows up there along with the link that I require on the image I tend to get one of two things happening...
a. A lot of requests to use a particular stock for cut/paste projects.
b. A lot of usage wherein my permission isn't requested.
c. Unauthorized usage/theft.

How do I decide to give or decline permission to use a premade or wing stock?



:bulletblue: I will visit your gallery and look at your recent and past manipulations to base my decision on quality, don't assume I will grant permision only because you asked.

:bulletgreen: If you have manipulations that really look to me like effort has been put into them...
:bulletgreen: If your manipulations look like cohesive images...
...Then I will be glad to give permission.

:bulletred: If you have manipulations that look like a  horse has been dropped onto a background...
ex. bright brown & white horse on a bright blue background...
:bulletred: If your manipulations are badly cut out...
:bulletred: If it appears to me that little effort has been given to the images...
...Then I will have to decline your request.

:bulletblue: I have no bias against anyone, I don't intend to offend anyone when I decline a request.

Asking for deviations to be removed



:bulletblue: If you don't ask first to use my premade or wing stock for a horse or wolf manip I will ask that you remove it.

:bulletblue: If you don't wait on me to give my permission prior to uploading a horse or wolf image containing my premade or wing stock, I will ask that you remove it.

:bulletblue: If you don't tell me that you've used my premade or wing stock on a horse or wolf, most likely, I will find out.
I recognize my own stock easily, so think carefully about failing to notify me and thinking you'll get away with using my image without permission.

Hint: If you don't ask or notify and I find out, I won't care if the image is good or bad quality.

:bulletblue: If I have asked you to remove your deviation because you failed to request my permission, I feel no sympathy for you, it is through no fault of mine that you failed to read a basic rule that is in bold type beneath the deviation. Neither anger nor empathy for your hours of work will move me.


I know this isn't the most eloquently put, but please bear with me.


  • Listening to: The laptop fan run
  • Reading: what I\\\\\\\'m typing
  • Watching: the words appear on the screen
  • Playing: on deviantart
  • Eating: nothing
  • Drinking: Raspberry Green Tea
Add a Comment:
 
:iconequinelullaby:
EquineLullaby Featured By Owner Nov 29, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
Winds of Winter - Premade Background by Thy-Darkest-Hour
may i use this for a horse manipulation.
you can see examples in my gallery of my manipulations.
im not the best out there by any means. but i d try very hard to make tings fit together and look like a picture...
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner Nov 29, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
Hello,

Thank you for taking the time to ask me. You may use my background stock for your manipulation so long as you agree to use a minimum 3 stocks total to create your image and use the phrase "Used with permission" next to the credit in the description.
Reply
:iconequinelullaby:
EquineLullaby Featured By Owner Nov 30, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
okay!
thank you so much!
Reply
:iconz0mdee:
z0mdee Featured By Owner Feb 3, 2014  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
Hm! Interesting, just finished reading. Will keep these in mind. 
I mean I don't plan on using the stock images I'm favoriting any time soon, and might not even use them at all. But if I do I have them favorited, and I always look over the rules before I use them (which is why I favorite them so I can keep track of whose rules go to which image).
Reply
:iconsheishido:
Sheishido Featured By Owner Jul 4, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
I was always curious as to why you had that rule with horses and wolves. I completely agree with your rules and reasons. To be honest, one my of biggest peeves on here is seeing that. My husband gets so annoyed with my rantings on this side of the computer when I come across a horse dropped on a background...then to see no credits given for the horse or the background is even worse when both are familiar to you. Its so insulting.
Cheers to you for trying to stop the madness. :clap:
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner Jul 4, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
:glomp: Thank you very much for your support. Despite my rules, I still try to be very reasonable with just usually asking that folks use at least 3-4 stocks in an image :D
Reply
:iconsheishido:
Sheishido Featured By Owner Jul 4, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
I love that you stipulate that. It should take at least that amount of images to consider a piece of work a "photomanipulation." Three is my minimum and it's only on "portrait" type works I do that have the least amount of stock used...which I try to make up with by painting.

Keep the faith and best of luck, hon ♥ :hug:
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner Jul 4, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Thank you :floating: You also.
Reply
:iconsheishido:
Sheishido Featured By Owner Jul 4, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Oh and thanks for posting those tips. It never occurred to me to try to use the clone stamp to make wings look "attached" (whether human or animal lol) I feel like I had the longest brain fart in my life. When I read that part I was in facepalm mode. lol. Clone stamp...so simple...and yet I never thought to try. *smh* XD
Reply
:iconmammothbay:
mammothbay Featured By Owner Apr 7, 2013
Hi there! I was looking through your wings and premades, and I'd really like to possibly use one or two for a manip for Howrse, and I've been reading this, and I completely agree. I haven't decided which wings or premade I'd like to use, so I decided to ask here. It would be awesome if you could check out some of my work and let me know if you'd be okay with me using them. Thanks!
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner Apr 7, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Hello, I'm glad you've enjoyed my wings and premades.

You may use either for images on deviantart (no rpg type sites) if you use a minimum of 4 stocks in the deviation and add 'used with permission' next to the credit link.

Thank you for inquiring.
Reply
:iconmammothbay:
mammothbay Featured By Owner Apr 7, 2013
Great! Thanks so much, I won't use it on Howrse then, but I will probably use some just for manipulations on here. I will make sure to say that next to the credit link. Thanks again!
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner Apr 7, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
You're welcome :floating:
Reply
:iconmammothbay:
mammothbay Featured By Owner Oct 13, 2013
I know I asked about this a while ago, but just letting you know that I will be posting an horse photo-manipulation using your wing stock later tonight (most likely), and it will not be used outside of DA.  Thanks!
Reply
:icon8rhyme-and-reason8:
8rhyme-and-reason8 Featured By Owner Dec 26, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
I honestly love this journal entry and how you explain thoroughly your reasons why you don't like people using your premades for those sort of things. I especially like that through this restriction, you're also encouraging growth and improvement in manipulators. :) I'm currently struggling to get the hang of manipulating - not just cutting and pasting.
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner Dec 27, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Wow, thank you, it's responses like this that really make my day :hug: I'm so happy that you saw this journal entry for how I meant it to sound. If you have any questions or want any sort of advice regarding manipulating or photoshop, please feel free to ask me and I'll help out if I know how.
Reply
:icon8rhyme-and-reason8:
8rhyme-and-reason8 Featured By Owner Dec 27, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Of course! It's nice to run into people that encourage real effort. :) And thank you so much!
Reply
:iconkassousminou:
kassousminou Featured By Owner Nov 23, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
It's not clear in my head ... we can't use your textures to create a bg on a horse drawing ? It will only be post here on DA ...
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner Nov 23, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
You can use my textures, just not my premades or wings without permission.
Reply
:iconkassousminou:
kassousminou Featured By Owner Nov 23, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
ok, thanks for the reply ;)
Reply
:iconkurureenu:
Kurureenu Featured By Owner Nov 16, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Do dogs count under the wolf thing since they are a cousin of canine to them? o__O
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner Nov 16, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Yes, dogs and all other animals count, I've been meaning to add that, thanks for asking. :floating:
Reply
:iconkurureenu:
Kurureenu Featured By Owner Nov 16, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
No problem. ^__^
Reply
:icong4uch3:
G4UCH3 Featured By Owner Nov 2, 2012
I wholeheartedly agree :]

Proportion, shadows, and overall blending are all too often SUPER OVERLOOKED :[
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner Nov 2, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Thank you :floating: I'm always glad when I hear others agree with this, thanks for reading.
Reply
:iconoh-windrunner:
Oh-windrunner Featured By Owner Sep 29, 2012
I know what you mean. It took me almost a week of hard work to make my newest manip. Granted, it doesn't look the best, but it's the first time I've completed a project with hair drawn in. I was also experimenting with shadows and the like... so it really gets onto my nerves when I see horses that were 'put into' grass, but you can tell the horse was cut out and slammed on with no further work.
Reply
:iconannagiladi:
AnnaGiladi Featured By Owner Sep 22, 2012  Professional General Artist
So, I read this and I do now kind of understand your reasoning. I don't like the OMG-wolf/horse-kitsch "movement" either.
Now, I do want to create some horse kitsch, but with a tad more work put into it than what you are worried about. Would you mind looking at my Manipulations folder and see if you could give me permission to use your creations on a horse thing?
[link]

Thanks!
Reply
:iconhpnyan:
hpnyan Featured By Owner Sep 21, 2012  Student General Artist
I am so with you on this:
:bulletblue: To begin: A horse dropped onto a premade background is not a photomanipulation; It is a cut/paste project.

:bulletblue: It makes me so very sad to see this happening.

:bulletblue: Please make an effort if you want to use premade backgrounds, use photo filters and refine your cuting skill and try new things.

:bulletblue: It makes me especially sad to see pre-cut horses dropped onto premade backgrounds, and even more so when the colors of the two images don't match at all.

:bulletblue: Also, particularly a horse on a beach has no originality; but at least think about putting a shadow on the image.

:bulletblue: If you truly want to use one of my premade backgrounds and I've declined permission, you're more than welcome to re-create the background using the same stocks that I used.


I go on rampages when people do THIS and call it a "manip" or "art." Because it looks like it was thrown together by a half blind preteen: [link]

You call THAT art? You call THAT a photo-manipulation?! The entire point to manipulating a photo is to alter it in order to express an emotion or convey some sort of realistic image in people's minds. It doesn't really take "artistic" skill to do THIS. All THIS is is a "Lookie hurr i made me a horsie in a meadow that doesn't have a shadow and hurts everyone's eyes to look at because of the colors and overall horribleness of this entire picture." -redneck voice

The maker of this specific "manip" is attempting to auction it for a starting bid of 5 million and an auto buy at 15 million in game currency. I'll just show you what 5 mill can buy on this particular game: [link]

That image isn't mind-blowing but it at LEAST looks real and you can tell how much effort I put into it and it attempts to look REAL not like a kindergarten cut & paste worksheet.

</rant>
Reply
:iconeutytoalba:
EuTytoAlba Featured By Owner Sep 9, 2012
Sorry this is unrelated to the content of your post....... but I absolutely love your journal skin! :)
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner Sep 9, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Thanks :) there really are some beautiful ones available for use.
Reply
:iconpancakeshiners:
PancakeShiners Featured By Owner Aug 6, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Is it just horses and wolves? I'm using neither in mine but I have several animals in the picture... There's more to it than that. I respect this completely, just want to make sure it's ok... Did you want to see the finished product before I upload it?

And also... What I made was meant to be a banner but I'm expecting someone to say no to me using it for that purpose... In which case it would simply just be another photo-manipulation... I'm going around to talk to all the stock owners, and this caught my attention.
Reply
:icondemontroll:
demontroll Featured By Owner Jun 18, 2012
Glad you had this explanation. I was wondering if "horse and wolf" was slang for some perverted fetish and I couldn't figure it out.
Reply
:iconmoushi730:
Moushi730 Featured By Owner May 29, 2012
Out of curiosity, why only horses and wolves, I mean anyone could do the dodgy cut and paste technique with just about anything. It's just out of curiosity really, I understand that you want something original rather than just the cut and paste deal.
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner May 29, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Mostly I have just been frustrated to no end by the majority of horse manipulators that drag and drop and then forget to credit me or credit wrong because they don't bother with reading my rules.
Reply
:iconlost-n-beauty:
Lost-N-Beauty Featured By Owner May 22, 2012
One of the things that drew me to photo manips was the fantasy stuff. Angels, pegasus, unicorns etc.. One of my first projects was a native american and wolves.. Didn't come out great but it was on a background that I made. I totally redid the stock of the guy. I put a ton of work into it... all though it looked bad lol. I also did a pegasus one that again... I put a lot of effort and it looked ok.
I like the horse and wolf stuff... Any of the art that its just a precut image stuck on a premade is not art. There is a ton of it out there. And look at all the eye balls.. I still want to do one of those lol
But this is your stock and you have a right to request whatever you want. Other premade bgs have shrunk their stuff down so far, the only one who can really use it is to cut and paste.
At least you gave an explaination to why you feel this way.. I have seen others flat out say they don't like horse art, angels or any type of fantasy. Its her right too. I just make sure I use nothing from her.
Even though my art is not that good yet..(may never be) I feel I put a lot of work into my stuff. I feel that the premades are a way to help those of us who are not that good yet, make something decent to look at. And if people work at it enough they will get better. But there are those that will not even try to put fourth an effort.. as in your example. We all have things that we don't like on DA.. celebs in the stock section and google as a credit , get me going.
I would say no cut and paste that an effort must be put fourth on all forms of photomanips, but that is what I would do. So while I don't agree with everything you said... I respect it. I respect that you gave reasons, when you didn't have too.
Reply
:iconseavannah:
Seavannah Featured By Owner May 10, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Very clear and with good reasons I totally agree on your rules.

I do have one little question though if a deviant asks you permission to use your wolves and horses and has proven themselves that they are not just using them to copy and paste with no effort does that person need to ask permission for each and every wolf and horse image they use in each and every painting they make? Or is it just to prove they will put effort into thier pics once and you will trust that they will use any other stock images with that kind of care?

Fully aware that we have to (and absolutly should) credit you for with a link in the discription and on the stock image deviation. Thank you for your time and thank you for your wonderful stock images to use!
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner May 11, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Thanks for your support of my rules :floating:

I haven't really had that happen yet, but I suppose that the second time someone asks I'd give them permission to continue using my images had they previously proven that they are indeed putting in effort to make a cohesive image.

Thanks for asking, this is a really great question and one I hadn't really thought about.
Reply
:iconmelanie-j-howle:
Melanie-J-Howle Featured By Owner May 9, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
understood loud n clear :D
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner May 9, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
:D
Reply
:iconangeliaart:
AngeliaArt Featured By Owner May 5, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Yes! I agree!
Reply
:iconunicornstar118:
unicornstar118 Featured By Owner Apr 30, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
You have good reasons.
Reply
:iconmarcoherrera:
MarcoHerrera Featured By Owner Apr 23, 2012  Professional Digital Artist
Great advice to follow indeed!!
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner Apr 23, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Thanks :)
Reply
:iconbnspyrd:
Bnspyrd Featured By Owner Apr 22, 2012  Professional General Artist
A very well written journal on the matter, and I totally agree. Hope artists or beginner digital artists get the message.
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner Apr 22, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
I'm glad that you find the journal well written, and that you agree, I very much hope that the message gets across in the end.
Reply
:iconhisgeenky:
HisGeenky Featured By Owner Apr 23, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
I really hope the same. Am so sad to see images poorly put together like that.
Reply
:iconjadiekrueguer:
JadieKrueguer Featured By Owner Apr 22, 2012  Hobbyist
I'm totally agree with you. A mean, i'm not great doing manipulations but at least I try to learn myself and try new things, a premade with a horse it's not a manipulation, at least people can use a model, clouds or whatever they want but putting effort on it, people are too lazy to use other stock, it's DA!! Theres a lot of stock to use not only horses!!

People should read your rules and respect them.
Reply
:iconroguetabby:
RogueTabby Featured By Owner May 16, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Though I agree with the artists request, I do not agree with you on one thing you say. You say there are more stock then just horses...well some of us only enjoy working with horses. Why is that such an issue for you?

No offence meant I'm just not understanding why you choose to say "There's a lot of stock to use not only horses"
Reply
:iconjadiekrueguer:
JadieKrueguer Featured By Owner May 16, 2012  Hobbyist
That was for people the just crop a horse into a BG and think: "thats it, I finish my work", you can put i don't know flowers, other animals and other stuff, manipulations with horses are beautiful when people made an effort, i see some great pieces, I don't have problems with people creating art with horses, the problem it's when just crop it and thats it.
Reply
:iconthy-darkest-hour:
Thy-Darkest-Hour Featured By Owner Apr 22, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Indeed, a drag and drop isn't a manipulation, and to those that get angry, I say: You're welcome to re-create the background :D I was so happy one day when someone actually asked if they could do that.

All of this could be avoided if people would stop for just a moment and read. I am though going through the effort to put 'No horse manipulations without permission' in a white space on the bottom of my most popular for horse manips bgs. :D That should work!
Reply
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